"I am coming to You now, but I say these things while I am still in the world, so that they may have the full measure of my joy within them." (John 17:13)
Who is Jesus saying 'I am coming to you' to?
Who is the "you" is in this part (John 17:13) of Jesus' prayer?Jesus is continuing his open prayer to the Supreme Being - confirmed by this verse after speaking with his disciples after the 'last supper:'
Jesus says "You" - not "me" or "us" here. But "You."
Think about it. If John Doe is talking to someone and he says "I going to call you" to that person, what is John Doe saying? John Doe is saying, first, that he is talking to someone besides himself: He acknowledges the existence of someone outside of himself. And second, that he will be calling that individual who is not himself. Right?
Now if John Doe was speaking out loud and said "I am going to call myself" then we could assume that John Doe is speaking of himself here. And if he was not addressing someone as he said this, we would say that John Doe was speaking to himself.
Yet many say that Jesus is God. Who was Jesus praying to then? Who is the "You" being referred to here by Jesus?
Or are they saying that Jesus was praying to himself but pretending to be praying to someone else?
At the same time, the Gospels indicate that Jesus did other things in the service of God. Here is a list of things that Jesus did while he was on the planet:
The Gospels indicate clearly some of the central activities of Jesus. Jesus:
Insulted. She would feel insulted that the man was ignoring and brushing aside the little baby she cared so much about.
Now take this feeling and multiply by one million. This is now getting close to how Jesus feels about those preachers and institutions that claim to worship Jesus but completely ignore the very Person who Jesus was loving and serving: the Supreme Being.
Jesus knew this was going to happen. He could see into the future and he knew that there would be so-called followers in the future who claim to fanatical follow Jesus. They would claim that they have "surrendered to Jesus" yet they completely ignore the Supreme Being. Check out this statement:
Many will fuzzy things up and say, well there is the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit - which is based upon Jesus' statements. But then they say these three are the same individual, and that individual is essentially Jesus.
This is erroneous and ridiculous. In fact, the Greek word translated to "Son" can actually mean "Servant" or "Follower" or "Subject" or "Representative" according to the lexicon. And yes, Jesus is certainly to be worshiped - as God's representative. And the Holy Spirit is certainly God's manifestation within - Who can guide us if we let Him. But this is God's extension - not Jesus.
After Jesus said this, he looked toward heaven and prayed: "Father...." (John 17:1)This means there are two individuals here: Jesus and God. Right?
Jesus says "You" - not "me" or "us" here. But "You."
Think about it. If John Doe is talking to someone and he says "I going to call you" to that person, what is John Doe saying? John Doe is saying, first, that he is talking to someone besides himself: He acknowledges the existence of someone outside of himself. And second, that he will be calling that individual who is not himself. Right?
Now if John Doe was speaking out loud and said "I am going to call myself" then we could assume that John Doe is speaking of himself here. And if he was not addressing someone as he said this, we would say that John Doe was speaking to himself.
Yet many say that Jesus is God. Who was Jesus praying to then? Who is the "You" being referred to here by Jesus?
Or are they saying that Jesus was praying to himself but pretending to be praying to someone else?
Could Jesus be God pretending to be a man?
If Jesus gets down on his knees and begins praying to someone, and then addresses that person as "You", could this be interpreted any other way? Could this still be interpreted as Jesus being God? That God would pray to Himself?At the same time, the Gospels indicate that Jesus did other things in the service of God. Here is a list of things that Jesus did while he was on the planet:
The Gospels indicate clearly some of the central activities of Jesus. Jesus:
- Taught about God (as being someone other than himself)
- Worshiped God
- Instructed his followers on how to Worship God
- Served God
- Healed people and said they were healed by their faith in God
- Instructed some to go to the priest and pray to God
- Loved God
- Prayed to God
Insulted. She would feel insulted that the man was ignoring and brushing aside the little baby she cared so much about.
Now take this feeling and multiply by one million. This is now getting close to how Jesus feels about those preachers and institutions that claim to worship Jesus but completely ignore the very Person who Jesus was loving and serving: the Supreme Being.
Jesus knew this was going to happen. He could see into the future and he knew that there would be so-called followers in the future who claim to fanatical follow Jesus. They would claim that they have "surrendered to Jesus" yet they completely ignore the Supreme Being. Check out this statement:
"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Many will say to me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?' Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'" (Matt. 7:21-23)This is a very clear statement, and it is describing the very sectarian institutions and their teachers who get fanatically sentimental about Jesus - calling him "Lord, Lord" - yet ignore the very existence - let alone serving or trying to love - the Supreme Being he had committed his life to.
Many will fuzzy things up and say, well there is the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit - which is based upon Jesus' statements. But then they say these three are the same individual, and that individual is essentially Jesus.
This is erroneous and ridiculous. In fact, the Greek word translated to "Son" can actually mean "Servant" or "Follower" or "Subject" or "Representative" according to the lexicon. And yes, Jesus is certainly to be worshiped - as God's representative. And the Holy Spirit is certainly God's manifestation within - Who can guide us if we let Him. But this is God's extension - not Jesus.
Who did Jesus claim to be?
Jesus never claimed to be God. He did say that he and God were united ("one"). He said he had the same will as God - which is what being united means. But Jesus didn't claim to be the Supreme Being.Jesus claimed that he was God's loving servant and representative. This means he should be worshiped not as God, but as God's perfect loving servant. As God's representative. God's agent.
By worshiping Jesus in this way, we find entrance into the loving relationship between Jesus and God. We are given access to the spiritual realm. This is the "stuff" of the spiritual realm - the loving relationships between God and His children. And once we gain access to that realm, we are able to come to know the Supreme Being, and we are able to develop our own loving service relationship with the Supreme Being.
Jesus is indicating this very issue as he prays. He first acknowledges that he knows he will be leaving his physical body soon - at the time of death - and will be returning to the spiritual realm to be with God:
It is called a relationship. Jesus is involved in a loving service relationship with the Supreme Being.
And that relationship gives Jesus joy.
So Jesus wants to share this joy with others. He wants others to taste the joy that he is tasting - this love that Jesus is feeling towards the Supreme Being and this relationship with Him - he wants others to taste this joy. This is also reflected in Jesus' most important instruction:
*Here is the translation of this verse of Jesus' prayer from the Lost Gospels of Jesus:
By worshiping Jesus in this way, we find entrance into the loving relationship between Jesus and God. We are given access to the spiritual realm. This is the "stuff" of the spiritual realm - the loving relationships between God and His children. And once we gain access to that realm, we are able to come to know the Supreme Being, and we are able to develop our own loving service relationship with the Supreme Being.
Jesus is indicating this very issue as he prays. He first acknowledges that he knows he will be leaving his physical body soon - at the time of death - and will be returning to the spiritual realm to be with God:
"I am coming to You now, but I say these things while I am still in the world..."And then Jesus details his purpose - not only for sharing this open prayer with his disciples: But his entire mission and teachings:
"...so that they may have the full measure of my joy within them."Yes, Jesus is feeling joy. What is that joy? It is the joy of love for God. It is the joy that comes with pleasing the Person Jesus loves. Jesus is immersed in this joy of loving and serving God. What is this?
It is called a relationship. Jesus is involved in a loving service relationship with the Supreme Being.
And that relationship gives Jesus joy.
So Jesus wants to share this joy with others. He wants others to taste the joy that he is tasting - this love that Jesus is feeling towards the Supreme Being and this relationship with Him - he wants others to taste this joy. This is also reflected in Jesus' most important instruction:
“‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.' This is the first and greatest commandment." (Matt. 22:37-38)
*Here is the translation of this verse of Jesus' prayer from the Lost Gospels of Jesus:
"But now I come before You, and these things I speak in the material world so that my joy will give them fulfillment.” (John 17:2)
